Would you have called this?

**Crundy** · 05-07-2009

OK, so on reflection I think I was right to call, with 15 outs (I think? 3xT, 3xQ, 9xH?). But considering the other players cards were unknown, I'm curious as to what the experts think?

GAME #-2055261156: Texas Hold'em NL Tournament 2009-05-07 20:30:59
Table Swansea, 293972971, -1730355625 (Tournament: Swansea Buy-In: $1+$0.20)
Seat 1: Cartuccia84 ($1,097.50 in chips)
Seat 3: Crundy ($2,050.00 in chips)
Seat 5: tebbo72 ($1,645.00 in chips)
Seat 6: giffo123 ($1,350.00 in chips) DEALER
Seat 8: grahazh09 ($1,497.50 in chips)
Seat 10: letsgojoe ($1,360.00 in chips)
grahazh09: Post SB $20.00
letsgojoe: Post BB $40.00
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to Crundy [HQ H10]
Cartuccia84: Fold
Crundy: Raise (NF) $120.00
tebbo72: Fold
giffo123: Call $120.00
grahazh09: Call $100.00
letsgojoe: Fold
*** FLOP *** [H6 D4 H7]
grahazh09: Check
Crundy: Bet $40.00
giffo123: Raise (NF) $1,230.00
grahazh09: Fold
Crundy: Call $1,190.00
*** TURN *** [C8]
*** RIVER *** [HA]
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot $2,860.00 Rake $0.00
giffo123: Shows [D7 CA]
Crundy: wins $2,860.00

**MoreheadD** · 05-07-2009

Really poorly played hand. Don't like your raise pre (based on your cards and position), the size of your raise pre (after the first level, I don't see the point of 3x-ing it), your weak flop bet (what was the point of that?), or your over call.

Quick questions?

How many outs do you have against a higher flush draw? Only 6 (25%)...with the possibility of losing to the redraw...bringing you to a lovely 18% equity.
Against two pair: You're a 2-1 dog.
Equity against a set? 25%

You basically got your dream scenario and you were coin flipping. Easy fold. With these kind of equity prospects, you might as well just open shove your whole stack pre- with any two cards, and, no, I'm not recommending that either.

**Crundy** · 05-08-2009

Preflop play was because I'd had a long run of crap cards and the blinds were going up on the next hand, so I thought I'd at least see the flop. What's wrong with the raise size? The flop minbet was just because the previous person had checked. Admitedly I should have put more in then.

I called because although the person who shoved had been playing tight, when they got short stacked they started shoving every time I put money in the pot, pre or post flop. As they didn't re-raise me preflop I assumed they did not have a pocket pair, and so I put them on a straight draw or a pair.

**4tun8** · 05-08-2009

Originally Posted by Crundy

Preflop play was because I'd had a long run of crap cards and the blinds were going up on the next hand, so I thought I'd at least see the flop. What's wrong with the raise size? The flop minbet was just because the previous person had checked. Admitedly I should have put more in then.

You couldn't have had a long run of crap cards if the blinds are only at 40, you've had about 10 hands total here. The raise pre flop is loose from MP1, these hands are better played from the CO/BTN.

Your min-bet on that flop is horrendous and if anything induces more check raises (which don't always mean strength).

I called because although the person who shoved had been playing tight, when they got short stacked they started shoving every time I put money in the pot, pre or post flop. As they didn't re-raise me preflop I assumed they did not have a pocket pair, and so I put them on a straight draw or a pair.

He's shoving because he's short stacked. You should realize there are short stacks at your table and stop limping pots, and when you do raise a pot you need to raise with some cards you're going to call a short stacks all in with. I can almost guarantee what you're doing is limping a ton of pots.

To clarify I'm not talking about the opponent you're playing being short stacked because he's not, I'm talking about what ever it is that you're talking about I assume from previous games.

To answer your question, no I don't call here. It's not worth 75% of my stack for a 300 chip pot on a draw.

**Crundy** · 05-08-2009

Originally Posted by 4tun8

You couldn't have had a long run of crap cards if the blinds are only at 40, you've had about 10 hands total here. The raise pre flop is loose from MP1, these hands are better played from the CO/BTN.

Agree on position, but the blinds started at 5/10 and we were quite a way in.

Originally Posted by 4tun8

Your min-bet on that flop is horrendous and if anything induces more check raises (which don't always mean strength).

I don't like the minbet either looking back on it. Not sure what my exact reasoning was. Just got trigger happy with the bet button maybe, or I didn't want to check.

Originally Posted by 4tun8

He's shoving because he's short stacked. You should realize there are short stacks at your table and stop limping pots, and when you do raise a pot you need to raise with some cards you're going to call a short stacks all in with. I can almost guarantee what you're doing is limping a ton of pots.

Actually I was tight up until then. I started limping a while afterwards. So are you saying you should tighten up even more when there are short stacks?

Originally Posted by 4tun8

To clarify I'm not talking about the opponent you're playing being short stacked because he's not, I'm talking about what ever it is that you're talking about I assume from previous games.

The guy was very short stacked but clawed it back before this happened.

Originally Posted by 4tun8

To answer your question, no I don't call here. It's not worth 75% of my stack for a 300 chip pot on a draw.

OK, that was what I asking for.

**breathoflife89** · 05-08-2009

I don't think the p/f raise is *terrible*. It's a bit loose, but if the table conditions are right then it's not really bad imo considering it's 6handed.
Edit: I bet flop bigger, and I don't call either.

**MoreheadD** · 05-08-2009

No, it's terrible! At these stakes, you're not going to take down the blinds even if you 5x it. You're going to get called by Kx, Ax hands and are essentially bloating a pot in which you'll likely niether be ahead nor know where you're at. And you're out of position. Really, what are you hoping for here? Flopping top pair? Delightful, negative implied odds. And I don't care how long you've sat there and not played a hand. You have 50BB and still have plenty if the blinds go up...not a reason to start playing weak hands out of position. And Crundy is bad enough, [not trying to rip on you, but you have to recognize where you're at] that he should be protecting himself from situations where he's tempted to call off his whole stack....because, as we see, he will succumb. FOLD.

**breathoflife89** · 05-08-2009

fwiw, I didn't notice that it was a $1+.20 tournament.

**4tun8** · 05-08-2009

Crundy do you have skype or AIM? I could either help you or you could watch me play SNG and MTSNG's.

**Crundy** · 05-09-2009

Originally Posted by 4tun8

Crundy do you have skype or AIM? I could either help you or you could watch me play SNG and MTSNG's.

That sounds like a cool idea. I'd be interested in watching you play. What site(s) do you play on though?

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