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  1. #1
    Mike McDermott
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    Default Punishing limpers

    Let's say we're playing an MTT, maybe an hour in, blinds are at 75/150 and our stack is about 1500. We will assume we are playing 9 or 10 handed here.

    It is our BB and there is no raise in front of us but several limpers, all with stacks greater than or roughly equal to ours.

    What sort of hand range do you have for shoving pre flop? Is shoving with ATC a decent play here?

    I was playing the other day and I was in this exact situation, 1500, 75/150, 3 limpers, I have T5o and I shove, everyone folds and I pick up a nice pot.

    I did another similar move with QTs in another tournament only this time I got called by AQ and lost (despite hitting a 10, so rigged)

    This made me wonder, do we need to have either a big hand or garbage? Are middling hands like KJ/QT no good for this sort of move?
    Quote Originally Posted by WotaWaster View Post
    LOL. David "Double Barell" ab157 says check. Check it is.
    Quote Originally Posted by WotaWaster View Post
    Brag: I cashed out $25k into a $ based bank account and have been to lazy to change it into £'s and earned hundreds of pounds through my laziness.

  2. #2
    Mike McDermott tightagressive's Avatar
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    Default

    Depends on the limpers and the range you give them from their stack and where they limp.

    Say its 75/150. the cutoff limps, the button limps, the sb completes. they all have about 2500, i have 1500 on the big blind. I feel these players are not great, but have fold buttons.

    I would probably shove any suited ace, any pair, KQ, KJ, any hand that has reasonable equity when called. vs their range.

    When people limp in from lp then call a shove, they usually have Kx like KQ, KJ, KT, Ax like A5 A6, or small pairs.

    If the antes are in say its 100 200 25 and i have like 2200 chips i might try to shove 78s in this spot.

    another example. its 100/200. utg has 11 bb and hasnt played a hand since i got moved to the table. he limps. mp limps with 1700 behind. I am bb. here my range is tighter for 2 reasons. One, their stacks make me have less fold equity, and two, a tight players limping range utg is, well, tight. he is probably calling. However if i only have 2000 and i see there is 700 in the pot or whatever im still probably shoving some hands that utg might have beat like AJs and 88 (he could have 99 or AQ) however when you have 10bb you are looking for the next best spot to gamble, knowing that you would much rather take a 60/40 with 10bb than going through blinds again and likely taking one with 7bb.

    hope that makes sense

  3. #3
    Mike McDermott
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    Default

    Makes plenty of sense, thanks!

    What about shoving trash? No matter what we have we are never going to have that little equity because we are so unlikely to ever be up against a big pair. Also, I think we pick up the pot very often?
    Quote Originally Posted by WotaWaster View Post
    LOL. David "Double Barell" ab157 says check. Check it is.
    Quote Originally Posted by WotaWaster View Post
    Brag: I cashed out $25k into a $ based bank account and have been to lazy to change it into £'s and earned hundreds of pounds through my laziness.

  4. #4
    Poker Expert wastrel's Avatar
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    Default

    I would never shove trash here, especially if we have an UTG or UTG+1 limper.

    I'm really not a huge fan of overt punishment to limpers until antes are a factor.
    If you are one in a million, there's eight just like you in Manhattan.

  5. #5
    River Rat ponceD's Avatar
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    Default

    I did it the other day with 10 3 off and ran into AA from the UTG limper. I am always looking for a rat when it comes to early limping. The funny thing is that I sucked out on him and that pushed me to the final table for a 395$ payday lol. Sometimes it seems like in the later stages of a tournie you just have to grab your nuts and gamble or blind out. I was happy he was not lol.

  6. #6
    piv
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    Stu Ungar piv's Avatar
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    Default

    I hate to keep quotoing it but alex's summary of M and tournament play is one of the best i've seen to date --> M

    your M is 6.66 so you're in push/fold, I see jamming with any two here as a profitable play.

    edti: not any two, but a huge huge range, any ace, king, pair, and two cards T and above.

  7. #7
    Mike McDermott
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by piv View Post
    Everyone hates it when I keep quoting it....
    +1
    Quote Originally Posted by WotaWaster View Post
    LOL. David "Double Barell" ab157 says check. Check it is.
    Quote Originally Posted by WotaWaster View Post
    Brag: I cashed out $25k into a $ based bank account and have been to lazy to change it into £'s and earned hundreds of pounds through my laziness.

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