Originally Posted by Dacriz

I could fold here and fold my way into the money. If I call and lose, I am down to 1800 and am short stacked and could end up on the bubble. What would you do?

I think that kind of answers your question. If you call and win you knock two players out and get a few more chips for an easy chip lead and ITM. That seems pretty good in itself sure.

But with TT you are likely up against at least 1 player with two overcards putting you at 50/50, if one has an overpair your odds are even worse. Against two all in players at least one of them has overcards and can easily draw out on you.

If you lose you short stack yourself, potentially no one gets knocked out if the short stack has the best hand and the middle stack also beats you. The only people who benefit in that situation are the shorter stacks at the table.

If you fold one of two things happen, the short stack loses and the other all in is now sitting pretty much even with you as chip leader, or the short stack wins and nothing much changes except for which player has chips.

AA or KK i would call all day long, TT seems a bit too marginal when you can just let the short stacks pick each other off. I would not jeopardise getting ITM for this hand.

fold to the money bud. easy decision. we dont need to make hero calls in this spot.

Originally Posted by Kayos

I only read the Title. No dont fold the best hand. If you get sucked out oh well. All you can do is get your money in with the best hand...

Haha I was thinking the same thing. Fold the best hand?? Why??

Originally Posted by Kayos

I only read the Title. No dont fold the best hand. If you get sucked out oh well. All you can do is get your money in with the best hand...

While that may be true of cash games it most certainly is not true of SnG/tournaments.

If the hand is like the one in question with pocket T's then it is easily drawn out on and not really worth risking missing out on getting ITM for unless the hero is short stacked which he isnt.

Another perfect example of being a good idea to fold with the best hand is this. You are BB in a 10 man SnG. You are dealt AA and UTG raises all in, everyone on the table calls and it comes round to you, do you call or fold?

You almost definitely have the best hand in that unlikely scenario, at worst someone else has AA also and you are tied for the best PF hand, if you call you MIGHT win and take 1st place, but then you may well lose and bust out with no money at all. If you fold you pretty much guarantee yourself 2nd place and a decent prize.

A pretty extreme example I know, but it puts into perspective that sometimes folding the best hand can be +cEV in the long run.

Originally Posted by zepthiir

Another perfect example of being a good idea to fold with the best hand is this. You are BB in a 10 man SnG. You are dealt AA and UTG raises all in, everyone on the table calls and it comes round to you, do you call or fold?

You almost definitely have the best hand in that unlikely scenario, at worst someone else has AA also and you are tied for the best PF hand, if you call you MIGHT win and take 1st place, but then you may well lose and bust out with no money at all. If you fold you pretty much guarantee yourself 2nd place and a decent prize.

I would call folding AA here a serious mistake. You may have a lower percentage advantage against everyone but making this play in the long run would still be profitable because of AA mathematical win percentage.

Originally Posted by KRE8R

I would call folding AA here a serious mistake. You may have a lower percentage advantage against everyone but making this play in the long run would still be profitable because of AA mathematical win percentage.

guaranteed 2nd if you fold = 30% prize pool payout. If you call and win you get only get 50%, or if you call and lose you get nothing. I dont have the patience to put AA into pokerstove against 9 random hands but I dont think your chance to win is worth the risk for only a small difference in prize money if you do win.

Originally Posted by zepthiir

guaranteed 2nd if you fold = 30% prize pool payout. If you call and win you get only get 50%, or if you call and lose you get nothing. I dont have the patience to put AA into pokerstove against 9 random hands but I dont think your chance to win is worth the risk for only a small difference in prize money if you do win.

20% difference between 1st and 2nd. I still think its more profitable in the long run to call. AA is about 33% against 9 random hands. When you split the rest up between everyone else you are winning way more often than anyone and getting first every time. I can't see how that wouldn't be profitable.

Originally Posted by KRE8R

20% difference between 1st and 2nd. I still think its more profitable in the long run to call. AA is about 33% against 9 random hands. When you split the rest up between everyone else you are winning way more often than anyone and getting first every time. I can't see how that wouldn't be profitable.

Ok, for a small sample lets take a $10 SnG, prize for 1st is $50, 2nd is $30.

If you fold you guarantee 2nd for $30, if you call you have a 33% chance of winning $50 and a 66% of getting nothing.

Replay this hand 10 times and you get $30 x 10 for $300 if you fold every time. If you call every time you win $50 x 3 for $150, round it up to 4 wins out of 10 and its still only $200.

How is this profitable? If you can guarantee that everytime you lose you get 3rd place I guess it may be profitable in the long run but otherwise im not so sure.