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  1. #1
    Chaser
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    Dec 2005
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    Default Donked hands, and some context

    A huge leak in my game is calling big bets/building the pot when I have TPTK or an over pair. I never know when I am best, and they are just being donkeys, or when they actually have it. Below is a bunch of hands from tonight in which I got stacked calling a big bet with an overpair (like I usually do), and the others are me taking down a relatively large pot with a very marginal hand given the action. How can I distinguish between these?

    1)http://www.pokerhand.org/?598003

    This guy was super loose and super agro, I should have raised the flop to $15 or so, and then check folded. This was so fucking stupid.

    2)
    a)http://www.pokerhand.org/?598008

    How am I ever supposed to know when I am good? They push with the goods, they push with nothing.

    b)http://www.pokerhand.org/?598015

    Same as above.

    3)http://www.pokerhand.org/?598021

    I think that this is my favorite hand of all time. The best part is that they both had the same hand.

  2. #2
    Mike McDermott gder03's Avatar
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    Default

    QQ - reraise on flop. nothing beats you unless he slow played AA or KK. On that flop you must re raise him.

    Fold on river. That is the sickest call I have ever seen. DO you really think he is tripple barelling with nothing? IMO it looks like he caught a flush. I think all your money should already be in on the turn. Awful call on river.

    KK - standard play on all streets.

    K9 - you wanna keep the pot smaller when your not holding a strong hand. Id check either flop or turn (while betting one of those streets). Also, on river, if you think your behind, making a defense bet, like 40% pot is acceptable. Tough to lay down on river b/c alot of missed draws will bluff river if you check. I'd prolly lose this pot too.

    99 - maybe raise that 4$ bet to like $14, kinda drawy board. once you call and that guy re pops it, you made the exactly correct play of reraising.
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  3. #3
    Chaser Jen-Jen The Enjen's Avatar
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    Default

    QQ- i'd always raise the flop here and we might get all-in a lot, then type "fuckcuntassshitmotherfucker" in the chat box. they're so bad and the crap i see amazes me. the river's an insta-fold as the hand played out. the flush hit. the king hit and you've been calling the whole time. if you had him beat on the flop, he was betting thinking you had AK, so why doesn't the K scare him? that'd be what i ask myself and fold.

    KK- i'd play the same.

    K9- i don't understand your turn bet. no real draws to protect and you want ace high, bad tens, and gutshots to call you down. you're already heads up, so i'd bet a little less than half-pot. same on the river. your hand isn't strong enough to check. i'd probably bet $10 on the river. you wanna stay in control once you take control. you usually have him beat and his hands are too tied to raise.

    99- that preflop raise is pointless. raise to $2.50-$3 or check. on the flop, i'd raise less than 3X his bet to $10 or $11. of course the all in is automatic after that. i'd do this with middle trips every time the bigger card is a face.
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  4. #4
    Chaser
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    Default

    The reason I just called the flop bet with the 99 was that I was pretty sure the guy behind me was going to raise, as it is a multiway pot, and he was generally raising. I knew once they were both sucked in I could safely push and get two callers.
    Jen - what if I get raised the river after betting half pot on turn and river, do you think it is safe to call most of the time?

    I know that QQ hand was awful, that s part of the reason I am still stuck at $50NL.

  5. #5
    PokerForums God the alex's Avatar
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    Hand #1

    This has got some draws out there worth pushing. Raise it willing to get all the money in. When I do just call, I come over the top close to the pot on the turn. But I don't like playing it slow. You get action from a ton of hands you beat because this board's so light.

    Hand #2a

    Standard. I like the turn bet. Only worse hands are shoving.

    Hand #2b

    I agree with Jenna's take similar to Hand #2a. I like keeping the pot small and you can make him look like a jackass with a small river bet. Only worse hands are raising because it's clear that you have the best hand after his turn call. You've been in control of the pot and it's clear that even if his hand beats you, he wants a cheap showdown. He's forced to look you up with just about any pair and Ace high if you lead out for $8-$11.

    Hand #3

    Yeah. That preflop raise is pretty bad. Preflop pot sweetening's overrated. It's clear that you have the best hand. Give them less than 2:1 to take flop. Raising to $2.75's good and if you have a read on SoulSam, playing him postflop OOP if you have to isn't a bad thing. The call on the flop's really bad in a sandwich. This is a good spot for a small raise. If you have this read on SoulSam, he'll put in a 3rd raise to a raise that looks weak, too. Your call induces him to make +EV calls, though. No doubt that a weak raise'll get him coming over the top with a lot of those hands he'd normally call behind your call with.

    Got all the money in with gin, though. Good times.
    Last edited by the alex; 11-07-2006 at 11:57 AM.
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  6. #6
    Poker Professional Eclipse86's Avatar
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    Hand 1:

    bet flop slightly harder..
    flat call turn cuz ur probably now behind..
    fold to a river bet..

    thers an overcard, a paired flop, possible straights, and possible flushes on the board... sorry for being harsh, but getting all your money in on the river with 1 pair on that board is just plain stupidity.

    Hand 2a:

    i just pop it up hard pf, and look to get it all in somewhere postflop as long as its non A high.

    however, based on the line u took.. i am potting the flop, check behind on turn, and flat calling a non club, 2 or 7 river.

    Hand 2b:

    flop bet was ok.. however i check call the turn, and check fold the river when that flush draw completes.

    Hand 3:

    flop, im raising right away instead of flat calling.. theres too many draws on that board, and I dont want to give anyone a free card.

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