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Thread: need advice

  1. #1
    JBr
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    Angry need advice

    i was playing 1 2 no limit live. I had been playing tight for about 2 hours doubling my stack up. I decided to open up a bit as the other players saw i was only playing top 20 hands so i have 67 suited on the button on a pretty conservative table i raise to 11 and i get one caller. the board comes j27 and i get middle pair and a flush draw. the caller bets 20 and i smooth call. the turn comes 7 giving me three of a kind. the other player bets 40 and i come over the top and she snap calls and flips jacks over. river was a dud. did i play the hand wrong or was it just a bad spot to open up?

  2. #2
    Mike McDermott Av8tor009's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JBr View Post
    did i play the hand wrong or was it just a bad spot to open up?
    Both... stick to playing tight aggressive and stay away from splashing around... on top of that getting fancy against people at 1-2 NL live is pointless since nobody knows anything about table image and nobody pays attention to anything except their own cards..
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  3. #3
    JBr
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    how did i play it wrong was i too aggresive

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    Mike McDermott Av8tor009's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JBr View Post
    how did i play it wrong was i too aggresive
    No... it's because you forgot to give the dealer your cards before the flop...
    Lead Columnist, BluffAway Online Poker Magazine


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  5. #5
    River Rat Ipokergood's Avatar
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    This is a classic example of how suited connectors/rags can get you into some serious trouble. I don't think you played the hand to bad, but it was some really bad timing, obviously. You made a pretty big raise preflop. I would have probably made it 7 preflop instead of 11. Then he might have reraised preflop and you can lay it down, or at least have a better idea of what he might be holding.

    Also, you should always stick to your game. Don't open up and do something you might regret just becasue you think you need to appear more aggressive to the other players. Play your game and stick to what you know best. Poker is a grind, so keep at it, live, and learn.

  6. #6
    Semi-Pro Moderator KnightofNarg's Avatar
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    Reads on opponent/stack size? You say you came over the top but that doesn't tell us for how much. Think about what hands that you believe she leads the flop and turn with and what we expect her to call a shove with. Is she going to lead with KJ,AJ,JJ (or wider)? Will she call a shove with one pair type hands?

    Ya, if you feel you have to make preflop raises that big then I wouldn't open up my range. Suited Connectors aren't bad to open up on the button, if you know what you're doing and expect to have fold equity.

  7. #7
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    Y'all might lambast me on this one here, and possibly rightfully so; it's been a few years since I've played consistently so the play's got a bit of rust on the ridges but...
    I wouldn't say that changing gears is bad. But yes, both, with a bit of bad luck.

    In a 1-2 game, you'd have to figure that she had something decent to start with if he called 5.5x blind. High connectors or a pair. Especially seeing that the table you described was conservative. (Unless she has a history of BS, bad play, and/or unconventionality) After the flop, she led and raised hard (10x). Pot odds aren't pretty in this scenario for the flush, but math doesn't rule NL, no? (Plus, two-handed, pot odds generally suck.) Still, you can probably rule out KK or AA since you weren't re-raised pre-flop. Since you raised, there's a chance that you might have those cards, or something strong. A jack is a possibility, is something she might've considered had she had weaker cards. She still led out virtually betting the pot, if I remember correctly. Once the turn comes, she bets pot again. It's tempting with your trips, but you definitely had to think something was up with her hand. Since she initially called, there was valid chance she had pockets to start and since she led in with the raise (ish), there was the possibility she hit. Since it was a live game, did she give off any tells? Also, there was the outside chance she hit trips too with a higher kicker.

    I'm an advocate of switching gears on the felt like switching hands behind the desk (Imagine my wicked smiley here), but you definitely have to know how to align your gears with those at whatever table your at. Plus, small suited connectors are (again, my poker knowledge is a bit rusted here so if more theory's been generated since I've left, please excuse me my ignorance here) generally a hand you get it for cheapish (a slight raise at best in a large game) and cash in on when you hit your desired hand (which'd be the nut straight) [btw, how big was the table?]

  8. #8
    Check Raiser Aces-o-8s's Avatar
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    This was a 1-2 NL cash game LIVE! At most live 1-2 games I've sat in on a $11 pfr is not only quite standard but even on the short side as $15-20 open raises are not unusual! I know it's crazy but at live games 6-10xBB are the norm not the exception which is why I spend most of the game trying to lower the pfr to $8-10 so suited connectors and mid-small pocket pairs can be played. Sometimes I can get the table to lower the pfr but not often enough. These hands need stack sizes of 20-25 x the pfr to be profitable in the long run so pfr is very important as to playing them or not!

    Playing 6-7 suited from the button isn't a bad play IMO as it keeps your opps wondering what your range really is. Depending on what the table has established as a normal pfr, that would be the best size to pfr and if that was $10-12 then $11 was the right size. But I often see weaker hands or mid-sized pocket pairs over-raised pf to discourage callers and steal the $3 in blinds - I think that's stupid but I can't control others preception of a smart pfr or keep them from giving me a tell via their bet size.
    I don't think JBr played the hand badly or shouldn't have played it at all (although hindsight is 20/20) and just got cold-decked - that's poker!! There was only ONE hand (2 if a better 7) that beat his trip-7s on the turn and he had a redraw to a flush! I wonder how many of you who critized his play could lay down his hand after the turn - except Av8tor who doesn't play suited connectors in position (and he's wrong to think 1-2 NL players can't play good poker as many can and do play very good poker!)?

    JBr - You just got unlucky which is a mathamatical certainty as even a 2nd nut hand will be beat a % of the time. The fact that your opps leadout on the flop indicates he's a pretty good player as most would slowplay a flopped top-set on a J27 board but he wanted to build a pot fast or not at all. Once you called, he had to figure you for a flush draw - what else could you call with since he had pocket Jacks and that only left one in the deck so it would be very unlikely you were just calling with it! That he bet so large on the turn is somewhat confusing since his now FH would beat a flush on the river and he should have let you draw to it - but he did and you unhappily got 3-of-a-kind to seal your fate. Bad beat - that's poker. Learn from it and move on without regrets...
    Last edited by Aces-o-8s; 05-06-2011 at 09:33 AM.

  9. #9
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    In most circumstances, I'd agree with you, but OP did note that the table was a conservative one. I interpret that as mild pre-flop raises, better quality hands wrt betting, etc.

  10. #10
    piv
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    lol what is going on in here

    pre is big but i'm assuming there was 1 or 2 limpers and that makes it fine

    raise flop with pair and fd, turn is a no brainer

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