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Go Back PokerForums.org > Strategy Discussion > General Poker Strategy > questionable push?

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  #11 (permalink)  
Old 12-18-2005, 03:43 PM
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Usually is spots like that i just call on the flop and see what the turn brings.

Even if you had raised it to 400, they may have called with 2 to come.
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  #12 (permalink)  
Old 12-18-2005, 05:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Beavis68
Usually is spots like that i just call on the flop and see what the turn brings.

Even if you had raised it to 400, they may have called with 2 to come.
If they call while on a draw - good! With pot odds at 2.2:1, they're making a mistake!
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Old 12-18-2005, 05:59 PM
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If they are on a draw.

it is one of those pass up a small edge things.

plus, if they bet larger on the turn that is more info. Also, one caller may give the next proper odds.

the odds are hitting a flush with two cards to come is better than 2:1.

this is a tough spot, i don' think there is an "easy" answer.
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Old 12-18-2005, 06:02 PM
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not sure where you got 2.2:1 from and I am not going to try to figure it out right now either, so dont hold me to anything I said about it.
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Old 12-19-2005, 09:35 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Beavis68
not sure where you got 2.2:1 from and I am not going to try to figure it out right now either, so dont hold me to anything I said about it.

(From previous post) Also, one caller may give the next proper odds.
Pot on flop = 510 add 400 bet = 910 SB. 910/400 = 2.275 so pot odds for SB to call is closer to 2.3:1 but I just dropped the last 2 digits for 2.2:1.

Re: one caller giving proper odds - If SB called 400 raise the pot is 1310 to MP2 whose getting 3.275:1 to call - enough for a flush in 2 draws but which needs 4.1:1 to see the NEXT card. Although the flush is 1.9:1 to hit in 2 draws, the pot has to give not less than 3:1 on BOTH flop and turn to make the call correct (implied odds). So, even if the flush card came on the turn but all folded to the obvious flush, the flop call would technically have been incorrect even thou it was made - curious isn't it?
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Old 12-19-2005, 10:43 AM
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The problem is if they are NOT on a draw.

Now you have built a large pot, almost the size of your stack.

If you keep the pot small on the flop, you can put some more presure on the turn if the card is safe, and still have the abality to dump your hand if someone has an Ace and is slow playing it.
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Old 12-19-2005, 11:56 AM
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I absolutely hate this play. Your all in is only going to be called by someone who has you beat. If called you have what? maybe 6 outs? Not a spot I want to be in.

I agree with the others that you need to be more aggressive on the turn here. raise it up stronger so that any draw will fold. Anyone with a weak ace may even fold. You are getting re-raised or MAYBE called by a strong ace. You would know where you stand and can avoid losing anymore chips.

Bottom line you would have had the same result without risking your stack.
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Old 12-19-2005, 12:05 PM
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I needed to be more aggresive on the flop, not the turn.

Also, if your me on the turn, what do you do?
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Old 12-19-2005, 12:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PowerfulRog
I needed to be more aggresive on the flop, not the turn.

Also, if your me on the turn, what do you do?
Shoot myself.
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Old 12-19-2005, 01:23 PM
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Assuming that you were more aggressive on the flop and were re-raised (and called the re-raise) I would be checking behind the raiser since he checked the turn. If he bet out,it would all depend on the odds, but I am probably done with the hand.

If he had only called my raise I would still probably check behind him, but I might fire at the pot one more time. Sometimes I fire, sometimes I try to check it down. A lot has to do with my read and the type of player. With an ace on the board as the overcard I am inclined to try to check this down after my opponent showed strength. It is much more likely that he is hanging around with an ace than a King (if a king was the overcard).
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