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  1. #1
    Fish
    Join Date
    Oct 2005
    Location
    Norman, OK
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    90

    Default B&M Tourney 5-handed AQo in CO vs All-in

    My local tourney: $20 for 2000, 1/2 hour "Pokerstars" blind schedule. Pay top 3, 50/30/20.

    Nine players busted down to five in under 2 hours (relatively quick for our game). 50/100. Average stack is 3600. I have 2100 in CO. Button has 3K, SB has 5K, BB has 7K, UTG is the shortstack with < 1K.

    I get AQo. UTG folds. I raise 300 to 400. Button folds. SB thinks, reraises all-in. BB folds. I have 1700 left, the pot is 2600.

    I ruled out AA. I thought it was too aggressive for KK. I put him on QQ-88 or AK-AQ, possibly AJs. I really thought it was a coinflip and figured it was the best spot to get back in the game. I call.

    He shows KK and I'm out.

    BB: *to SB* "Man, that's exactly what I put you on."
    SB: "I didn't think you'd call."
    Me: "I didn't think you had KK. You don't buy the pot with KK."
    SB: "I figured you had Ace-somethin'."
    BB: "Yeah, man, you don't want to let an Ace flop."
    What I wanted to say: "Had you reraised all-in thinking I wouldn't put you on KK then I'd say 'nice play,' but you're saying you just wanted to take it down right there. I wouldn't play KK like that, but I don't have any chips so I guess I'm wrong."
    What I said instead: "I don't like the play. I'm not sure you want me to fold there, but good hand."

    Even if I had put him on KK, the pot was giving better than 1.5:1 which in my position in the tournament might be good enough to gamble a 2:1 considering I'd need to get lucky one way or another to have a shot at HU.

    But should I have put him on KK? Was his play and/or his logic as incorrect as I think it was? Was my play and/or logic as bad as the situation proved it to be?

  2. #2
    Chaser
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Posts
    103

    Default

    Here's my take FWIW...you said it yourself, you are probably a coinflip. He may make that move with AJ or any other ace (reads help here), but for the most part you're probably up against a pp or AK. You're 2 posoitions away from the money...do you want to risk that on a coinflip? Its really up to you...some players like to limp into the money, some players prefer to try and win it all at the risk of busting out on the bubble. Personally I would probably have folded...1700 left with 100 blinds isn't TOO bad, still time for you to make a move in a better spot.

    As for his push, I don't mind it...alot of people will call a push late in a tournament thinking exactly what you were thinking... "I'm a coinflip and I might not get a better chance".

  3. #3
    Poker Hustler Jason75's Avatar
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    Sep 2005
    Location
    San Francisco, CA
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    1,230

    Default

    I like his play with KK, but for entirely different reasons than he states. I'm begging a call with KK here, and I think the best way to get it against a tight-aggressive (I'm assuming this is your play type) short stacked opponent is to go all in. I steal a lot of blinds at these later levels with absolute crap (you get used to putting in raises with 72o once you've figured out the "rotation" of blind stealing at that particular table), and most of the time the shorty will think I'm buying the pot with a re-steal and he's either ahead or a coinflip. He'll also look at his chipstack and think "can I really afford to fold this"? Then he'll consider his pot odds - which begs a call at a coinflip.

    And then . . . BANG.

    BTW, when I don't get a call, I show the hand down anyway - helps keep the steals coming.

    As for what you should do: Fold the AQ. Your steal attempt didn't work, and I'm not keen on calling off my whole stack with AQ. Focus on stealing the blinds and staying on the raising side, not the calling side. In the long run raisers win, callers go home.

  4. #4
    River Rat
    Join Date
    Sep 2004
    Location
    Philadelphia, PA
    Posts
    478

    Default

    I would have folded in your spot. You weren't in a desperate situation. You still had 17 big bets left and a chip stack that represented between 30% and 67% of the stacks remaining in the game, more than enough to make people think twice when you can be the first to move all in. Moreover, of the range of hands that your opponent might be holding, AJ is really the only one where you're a favorite. You're a dog to any pocket pair, and a big dog to AK, QQ, KK, and AA, none of which could you confidently rule out.

    To me, this is an easy fold, especially only two spots until the money. It's always better to be the one moving all the chips into the center than to be the one calling an all in.

  5. #5
    Poker Professional Girevik's Avatar
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    Sep 2004
    Location
    Columbus, OH
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    1,731

    Default

    I think you really need to take payout structure into account. If just making the money is a decent payout, then it may not be worth the risk. If, you the other hand, you need to get deep into the money to make it meaningfull then this isn't a bad shot to take a coinflip chance to double up.
    I'm CDO. It's like OCD, but everying is in order just like it should be.

  6. #6
    River Rat
    Join Date
    Sep 2004
    Location
    Philadelphia, PA
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    478

    Default

    A situation very similar to the one you faced was analyzed today on Cardplayer.com. Here is a link: http://www.cardplayer.com/poker_odds/

    In that hand, the SB held AKo and the BB held 33. With the blinds 10k/20k, the SB raised to 70k, and the BB re-raised to 250k, putting the SB all in.

    The SB called (and eventually lost), but cardplayer suggests that he should have folded, writing, "AK is usually a great hand to raise with, and not too good to call with." Of course, if AK is a marginal hand to be calling an all-in with, then AQ is often in even worse shape.

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