PokerStars 0.25/0.50 Hold'em (9 handed) converter

Preflop: Hero is BB with , .
1 fold, UTG+1 calls, MP1 calls, 2 folds, CO calls, 2 folds, Hero checks.

Flop: (4.40 SB) , , (4 players)
Hero checks, UTG+1 checks, MP1 checks, CO bets, Hero raises, UTG+1 folds, MP1 folds, CO 3-bets, Hero calls.

I like the flop a lot and feel this is a normal check/raise to drive the others out. Flush draw worries me a bit and CO 3 betting screams trips, but I decide to call (my raise having the effect I wanted which was to get heads-up against CO. I have no real reads on him here...

Turn: (5.20 BB) (2 players)
Hero checks, CO bets, Hero calls.

I really didn't like my call here. I'm thinking at this point, I could still be up against a flush draw, A single pair or a bluff...I think I should have raised for information.

River: (7.20 BB) (2 players)
Hero checks, CO bets, Hero raises, CO 3-bets, Hero calls.

Ok, I need to agressive here (Like I should have done on the turn) to find out where I'm at. Shit, he raised my check/raise....let's see what he has.

Final Pot: 13.20 BB

Results in white below:
Hero has Th 5h (two pair, tens and fives).
CO has 5c 7c (two pair, sevens and fives).
Outcome: Hero wins 13.20 BB.

This is one of those hands where I really thought I may be beat on the river, but I felt the pot size (after my check raise I was getting better then 10:1 to call) warrented a call. I really think I should have dropped this hand before the river though, I just can't determine where I would have had solid enough information to warrent a lay down. I know my play here was horrible, please tell me why.

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Trons
JstTrons
Toyotatruck

I think you're a bit early to worry about trips on the flop since you have 2 of the three cards on the board. So while a set would be most likely with 7s, it's about 8:1 against it and wouldn't most players with a set wait until the turn to re-raise their set?

I agree with you assessment of the turn - should have check-raised here.

Can't really fault the river either although the set looks more likely now and calling down might have been more correct than raising.

Judging by a few of your last posts I think you are very quick to put a hand on a player, then not allowing flexibility to change your initial read to other possibilities. Also, once you take a read, you seem reluctant to believe it and then make quetionable bets in accordance to what you have lead yourself to believe. In the Theroy of Poker, you win/lose ratio depends on how close you play the hand to what you would have if you knew what the other player had. Here you put the guy onto 3-of-a-kind but instead of folding or calling down looking for a full house, you raised the river and carried on to sd to "....let's see what he has." Isn't that the trait of a Calling Station?

I only said his 3 bet on the flop screamed trips at that time. The probem with that scream was that I didn't have a good read on him at the time, and there were a lot of other cards he could have had and played that way. Heck, I've 3 bet TPTK before because I felt the other guy didn't have a better hand.

I raised the river because I should have raised the turn, but at no point was I more then 90% sure I was behind which is what SSH recommends before you fold to a bet/raise on the river. Better to lose one bet then lose a 12BB pot.

I knew I hadn't played it right, but my big questions revolve around A) should I have capped the flop, B)bet, C/R or fold on the turn and C) bet/call, flat call or fold on the river.

I know I played it horribly, but I'm not quite sure why. Obviously I left money on the table, but that's hindsight. I often get accused of being overly agressive with 2pair or better, I've been trying to slow down a little, but in this case, should I have? That's why this hand makes me go hmmm...

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Trons
JstTrons
Toyotatruck

cap flop and get raising on the turn

at these stakes you dont need to be tricky, just play abc and let them make the mistakes

90% sure you're behind?? I have SSH on order and it should be here in a couple of days. I'll be very interested in the section that brings up these percentages for a call or fold!

As for raising on the river to make amends for a precieved error on the turn I'm not so sure that's a good reason for raising. What happened on the turn, happened and it's done with. The river should be played on your read at that time and not what you should have done the last round - yes or no? My style of play in Limit is to try for the close on the turn and unless I have the absolute nuts to shut it down asap on the river even when I lead out. I too may leave some money on the table from time to time but the savings I get when I'm wrong over-compensate.

Page 205 "Playing the river when the pot is big" Half way through the first paragraph...

"to fold a good hand on the river, you often need to be over ninety percent sure that you are beaten. Against an illogical player, you can you ever be ninety percent sure about what he has."

It goes into far more detail through out the chapter, this is just in the final thoughts section of the chapter. If I have no read on this guy, I can't be sure he's logical or illogical. Hindsight puts him in the illogical play, but the questions here weren't about his play, it's about mine. Obviously in hindsight, I should have either capped all rounds (what I would have done had I known what he had) or played far more conservately. I tried to get fancy and while I won, the play wasn't where it could have been.

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Trons
JstTrons
Toyotatruck

Cap the flop, bet the turn. If he rasies on the turn you might want to go into call down mode then.

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“There's no sense in being precise when you don't even know what you're talking about.” - John von Neumann

yep, agreed 100%

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www.myspace.com/sixyearsilenceband

Gotta tell ya this is the correct play, I agree.
The A on the turn sucks though, as I would play A10 this way every time if I was villian. But I would still cap flop and bet out on turn despite the A as you can't give a flush draw a free card.
If he raises the turn I go into calldown mode because of size of pot. I am not folding anywhere here even if a diamond falls. The only way I consider check/folding is if Ad falls on turn - that is such a death card that it is hard to believe you are ahead, although you would still have odds to call to see if river boats you.