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Thread: AX vs KQ suited

  1. #1
    Fish Food
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    Default AX vs KQ suited

    Cardplayer odds calculator
    I plugged in a few hands and also had a list of playable starting hands. I was really surprised to see A3o (53.9%) came out a favorite to KQs (46.1%). AXo is never even listed as a playable starting hand. Is there an easy explanation for this?

  2. #2
    Banned Irexes's Avatar
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    Yes.

    If you play it you will lose a bundle to AK, AQ, AJ, AT etc every time an Ace flops.

    If you manage to only play it against KQ then you will win in the long run, but that is like saying 73o is favourite against 62o and should therefore be played.

  3. #3
    change my title babo bonchkid's Avatar
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    Do A3o vs a random hand
    Do KQs vs a random hand
    Explained.

    Now for more fun, do AKo vs 44.
    Now 44 vs JTs
    Now JTs vs AKo

    Poker Stove so fun :O
    “There's no sense in being precise when you don't even know what you're talking about.” - John von Neumann

  4. #4
    Poker Hustler Jason75's Avatar
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    The A3 is a favorite over KQ because it's already ahead and doens't need to improve to win.

    Be careful with those odds calculators for a couple of reasons:

    1. That we know the odds assumes we know what our opponent is playing, and unless you're cheating or he's telling you, we don't.

    2. They assume that the hands are played to a showdown. How often will you stay in a hand with 44 against a flop like Q J 7, even when your opponent has AK? While you have the best hand right now, it's very difficult to know that, and you opponent has 10 outs (22% to hit on the turn) to a more or less unbeatable hand.

    I think when a lot of players put in small pairs against AK and find out they're actually a statistical favorite PF, they then tend to overplay these hands.

  5. #5
    Chaser
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    Default

    very good answers, I think I have been overplaying certain hands :P

  6. #6
    change my title babo bonchkid's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jason75
    The A3 is a favorite over KQ because it's already ahead and doens't need to improve to win.
    Careful.

    JTs vs 44 preflop

    6s7s vs AhAd
    Flop 4s5s6h

    AA is "ahead" but not a favorite.

    Generalizations in poker are almost never good :O
    “There's no sense in being precise when you don't even know what you're talking about.” - John von Neumann

  7. #7
    (Formerly Steve-O) Steve Ruddock's Avatar
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    Bonch don't take a good point and HAVE to argue the exceptions to the rule. Jason makes a good point and you basically make a useless antagonistic post.
    Read my musings on poker and life at Online Poker Examiner, Poker Examiner, PokerNewsBoy.com, and My Poker Blog

  8. #8
    Mike McDermott gder03's Avatar
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    when playing heads up, you should give more value to Ax then KQ
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  9. #9
    PokerForums God
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    KQ does better vs a random hand than Ax.

  10. #10
    (Formerly Steve-O) Steve Ruddock's Avatar
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    Ax (especially the lower Xs) is also dominated by more hands people are likely to push with.

    If your opponent could have 22-AA, A2-AK, KQ, KJ, QJ

    A7 is 43% to win

    A4 is 40% to win

    A2 is 37% to win

    KQs is 45% to win

    KQ is 42% to win
    Read my musings on poker and life at Online Poker Examiner, Poker Examiner, PokerNewsBoy.com, and My Poker Blog

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