Texas Hold'em $1-$2 (real money), #1,448,458,226
Table Olomouc, 7 Nov 2005 7:33 PM ET
Seat 1: eezyally ($45.65 in chips)
Seat 2: zebrachick ($32.25 in chips)
Seat 3: frankmcc ($89 in chips)
Seat 4: HITMAN_G ($73.65 in chips)
Seat 5: PJofTheGame ($40 in chips)
Seat 6: khankill ($35.95 in chips)
Seat 7: mycroft666 ($45.50 in chips)
Seat 8: crice25 ($171.90 in chips)
Seat 9: dianea ($40.95 in chips)
Seat 10: Chadmw1 ($35.50 in chips)
ANTES/BLINDS
dianea posts blind ($0.50), Chadmw1 posts blind ($1), PJofTheGame posts blind ($1).

PRE-FLOP
eezyally folds, zebrachick folds, frankmcc calls $1, HITMAN_G calls $1, PJofTheGame bets $1, khankill folds, mycroft666 folds, crice25 folds, dianea calls $1.50, Chadmw1 calls $1, frankmcc calls $1, HITMAN_G calls $1.

FLOP [board cards 3D,8S,3H ]
dianea bets $1, Chadmw1 folds, frankmcc folds, HITMAN_G calls $1, PJofTheGame bets $2, dianea calls $1, HITMAN_G calls $1.

TURN [board cards 3D,8S,3H,2D ]
dianea bets $2, HITMAN_G folds, PJofTheGame calls $2.

RIVER [board cards 3D,8S,3H,2D,JS ]
dianea bets $2, PJofTheGame calls $2.

SHOWDOWN
dianea shows [ AD,3S ]
PJofTheGame mucks cards [ QS,QC ]
dianea wins $23.
SUMMARY
Dealer: crice25
Pot: $24, (including rake: $1)
eezyally, loses $0
zebrachick, loses $0
frankmcc, loses $2
HITMAN_G, loses $4
PJofTheGame, loses $8
khankill, loses $0
mycroft666, loses $0
crice25, loses $0
dianea, bets $8, collects $23, net $15
Chadmw1, loses $2



... I said on the flop that if he calls this raise and then bets out on the flop, he has a 3, which is why i didn't push any harder. Still felt I had to call down though :/ What do you guys do in this situation? Fold... or pay him off?

__________________
-You may not know this, but poker is a game of incomplete information.

I wouldn't have put him on the 3 because of his play. I would have put him on an overpair, or an 8. If he had reraised you on the flop, then maybe I could have put him on the 3. If he had checked raised you on the turn, maybe I could have put him on the 3...

To me, betting out on the turn is screaming that he rethought his pair of 8's and decided you didn't have a 3, and you could have had 2 overcards and your raise was a continuation bet from your PF raise or a way of keeping control of the table. Either way, I probably would have raised on the turn, and called him down if he reraised me..

__________________
Trons
JstTrons
Toyotatruck

Since dianea only called your flop raise, It is a little surprising she led out on the turn but even more surprising to me that you didn't raise her! If she had re-raised, then you could start thinking a set or 2 pair but what other information would give you that impression? Had you raised and she come back over top of you then you have pretty strong evidence you're behind. Oh well, at least this way you got to see her cards for the minimum fare.

I make that play sometimes when I have a rediculously obvious winner and an agressive player with a fair holding. You don't want to scare the sucker away by showing too much strength when the bet size is small and you're way ahead.

"To me, betting out on the turn is screaming that he rethought his pair of 8's and decided you didn't have a 3, and you could have had 2 overcards and your raise was a continuation bet from your PF raise or a way of keeping control of the table. Either way, I probably would have raised on the turn, and called him down if he reraised me.."

I don't know why I was so sure about that read... but I never am that sure online, and couldn't go against it. It's like I was reading his mind. I think you're right there in a normal situation... keep betting. Hell, I usually do

__________________
-You may not know this, but poker is a game of incomplete information.

I make the move myself, but I do it as a check raise. I lead out on the flop, and PF raiser raises me, I'll call (for fear of scaring him away on the small bets) and check raise him on the turn...that way I get 2 extra bets from him. By your way of thinking (leading out on the turn), you're much more likely to scare him away and not get anymore money out of him. I only do that when I'm in a big field and I want to project the strength of my hand...Not in a small field where I'm trying to extract the most amount of money from them.

If I lead out on the turn, after calling a flop raise (that wasn't capped) and the game is HU (or a small field), it's because I've rethought the hand and suddenly feel that my TPTK is good and they didn't have the set I thought they did on the flop.

Obviously your read was correct, so I can't suggest you go against your gut, but if you "knew" he had the three, then the correct play is to obviously fold. If you're going to raise for information, get the information your looking for, then you should act on it. Unfortunately, that's something I'm still working on.

__________________
Trons
JstTrons
Toyotatruck

"Obviously your read was correct, so I can't suggest you go against your gut, but if you "knew" he had the three, then the correct play is to obviously fold. If you're going to raise for information, get the information your looking for, then you should act on it. Unfortunately, that's something I'm still working on."

lol... seriously. I trusted my read enough to stop contesting the pot... but still didn't fold. I call down in situations where I'm pretty sure I'm beat routinely, and am frequently shocked by the trash people cap the flop with. Why I asked here... and I appreciate your input

However, you answer the wrong question... You tell me why you think my read is bad, and that's fine. But the question is... if my read says "3" do I fold or pay off?

__________________
-You may not know this, but poker is a game of incomplete information.

I guess what I was trying to say is I didn't understand why you would raise for information, get it, then not act on it. Ironically, I could see playing this way if you felt that because of his play he didn't have the 3. If you "knew" he had the three, then why continue to even call down. I'm not saying that sarcastically. I'm asking you why seriously.

I've raised for info on the flop and gotten the info I wanted and folded because of it, only to find out the guy was just very agressive. Had I called down, I would have won. I'm still working on which situations require that type of bet, and what kinds of players you can get that kind of information from. Nothing pisses me off more then to raise somebody on the flop (similar situation as above) only to have them call you all the way down with the trips...

__________________
Trons
JstTrons
Toyotatruck

I wasn't specifically raising for info... I figure there is a great chance I'm ahead, and he'll call me down with an 8. I honestly don't know why I called down. That's why I posted this... I figure ya'll can talk some sense into me

__________________
-You may not know this, but poker is a game of incomplete information.

This is why I don't play limit Holdem online for low stakes. Impossible to get a read her IMO, and nothing unusual about someone calling raises with A3 online.

lol... that's the good part. How ELSE is a fish like me supposed to make money?

:rockpoker

__________________
-You may not know this, but poker is a game of incomplete information.