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This happened a couple times last night online, and I'm not sure what to do.
Playing .10/.25 NL hold'em. Im the dealer, and I get Ac,3c. Cant remember, but I think I limp in for .25. There are only 3-4 others players. Flop is Qc,9h,3c. It checks all around to the last guy before me and he bets the pot (~1.50). i fold it. Was I stupid to do this? I had it happen again last night, not with an A, but two spades and 2 spades on the flop. Not sure how to play this?
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Thread: Flush?
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03-02-2005 #1Fish
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Flush?
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03-02-2005 #2The Forefather
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Here I think there are 2 factors you need to consider:
1. Simple pot odds. On the flop, you have a 35% to hit your flush on either the turn or river. 19.1% on the turn, and 19.6% on the river. The pot is around $2.50 by the time you have to make your flop call decision.. it will cost you $1.50 to enter a $2.50 pot, almost 50%, whereas you are only going to hit on the turn 19% of the time.. so in the long run, these bad pot odds make this a very bad call if you indeed call.
This is why you should limp in with Axs when there are more people in the pot - 3-4 people don't make me limp in with Axs.. I usually need at least 5..
Thus, your fold was good.
2. The other factor you should factor in is your opponant's style. Is he agressive? Is he tight? Will you get a lot of action from him if he has a decent hand, and you make your flush? If so, you are factoring in implied odds, and sometimes, even though your pot odds are horrible here, if you hit your flush, you can take a lot of money from him. You have to be very sure you will get a lot of action from him though, if you hit your flush.
Hope that helps!
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03-02-2005 #3Fish
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This helps a lot, thanks a bunch, Kid.
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03-02-2005 #4Check Raiser
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If there's two 3c's in the deck you might wanna call for a deck change
Originally Posted by Zonetrap
Seriously though, you need to make a spot call here -- you're not getting odds if you call the bet and wind up as the only person in, but if you sense that one (or more) other person will call also behind you, then you can make the call and try for the flush. Even if you miss the flush, you might catch an ace that might also win you the pot.
I wouldn't bother if I didn't have the nut flush draw though. If you're holding like a Tc5c then all you're doing is asking for trouble when you hit your flush and discover -- surprise!! -- there's a bigger one out there.:cool:
To be successful in business, surround yourself with professionals. To be successful in poker, surround yourself with idiots.
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03-02-2005 #5Fish
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Ha ha ha, I didnt notice I put in 2 3c's. Funny. Must have been another club, I know there were two clubs on the flop. . .hopefully.
This is good advice, I was really up in the air on what to do. This is definitely helping.
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03-02-2005 #6PokerForums God
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You guys are ignoring implied odds.
If you guy both have $20 or so in front of you, you are getting plenty of odds if you think you can get more if your flush hits. If you think you can get 6 or more out of him if you hit the flush it may be worth a call if you like playing implied odds. That is giving you about 6:1 odds total.
Any everyone is missing something really big here.
You don't just have a flush draw, you have a pair and a flush draw.
This gives you an addition 2-5 outs. If your opponent doesn't have a set, or a pair with an ace in his hand, you could be a slight favorite in the hand.
With 11+ outs, you have to see the turn here. You may even want to raise for a free card here.
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03-02-2005 #7Fish
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I didnt have the pair, I know that, it was a typo on my end.
Would that change your view?
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03-02-2005 #8The Forefather
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Implied odds are not great here as if you do hit your flush, your opponants are going to slow way down. Wouldn't you in their shoes?
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03-02-2005 #9PokerForums God
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Yes Zone, that would change the view, you hand is not as strong.
Kid, yeah your opponent may slow down, it is important to know them. That is why I was saying that you need to be able to get a decent amount off of them if you hit, if you don't think you can it is a clear fold.
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03-02-2005 #10The Forefather
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lol Beavis, read my original reply :P
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