here is a hand from a multi table tourny where i feel that a lack of agression may mave cost me a pot.
level 4 of a MTT start with 1500TC, blinds are 25/50, buy in was $2
i have 2025 after winning a pots hitting AJ.
I am UTG and decide to limp with AsQs, not sure if i shound raise here but i decided not to as i am first to act and have the option of folding if anyone shows heavy strength. 4 players limp as do BB and SB. should i consider folding AQs UTG?
Flop 7c 9s 4s (pot is 750ish)
SB and BB check, i bet 250, Button and BB call. i am pretty sure i should have made a larger bet here!
Turn 6d (pot is 1500ish)
i check thinking there is a fair chance my opponent will check as he only called my flop bet, i plan to check/call if he bets small enough to give me odds to make my flush. he bets a little over 1/2 the pot i feel he has some kind of made hand (such as pair and an overcard). i feel i cannot call or raise with the flush draw and overcards with only 1 card to come.
i am wondering whether i should raise the size of the pot or more at the flop with 2 overcards and a nut flush draw? maybe i should not have played the hand from UTG? any thoughts?
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Thread: Lack of agression?
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February 8th, 2005 #1
Lack of agression?
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February 8th, 2005 #2Daniel Negreanu
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Ok, here is my advice on the hand.
Yeah, AQs good UTG.
I would of course raise it, try to raise it like I would AA or AKs. You can raise it to 200 and still fold if anyone pops it back at you.
How did the flop get to 750? With 4 limpers and the blinds is should be 350 right?
If I had raised it pre-flop and had any callers, I would consider just pushing it all in with this great draw and being OOP. You are actually a favorite over most pairs, and you even have 12 outs against KK.
Since you just limped, I would probably check-call here trying to draw (although is there really is 750 in the pot it may be worth pushing).
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February 8th, 2005 #3
oops 7x50 isn't 750 its 350 lol, like Beavis said.
i think my flop bet must have been smaller too i think i bet 1/3-1/2 of pot.
apologies for mis reporting in my post!
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February 8th, 2005 #4
Raise PF, probably at least 200, and run everybody off. at worst you get 2 callers.
Bet the flop, at least 1/2 pot, anybody who called a PF raise, this most likely missed.Luck is a Residue of Design.
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February 8th, 2005 #5
obviously this table is not tight so you have to raise from UTG. your giving these guys a free or cheap shot to hit a hand and if an ace or a queen flops your gonna pay off a shit 2 pair because you let them in cheap and have no idea if they have a legit hand or not.
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February 8th, 2005 #6
Yup, raise preflop 200 sounds good, fold to a big reraise unless they have previously proved to be reliably stupid (allin KJ etc, entirely possible at that level of a cheap MTT).
Bet the flop harder and either pick it up right there based on your preflop show of strength or make it pot really worth winning if you get callers or a raise and then hit the draw.
Unless I have the others in the pot well covered I'm less inclined to push on the flop with these draws in MTTs, but I'd certainly be prepared to put a big chunk of my stack in the middle.
Rex
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February 8th, 2005 #7Daniel Negreanu
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if there was only 475 or so, and you still had 1800, pushing would be excessive, if there were much more though - I like the Doyle Brunson/Bob Ciafonne move of all-in OOP with a big draw.
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February 8th, 2005 #8Daniel Negreanu
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Been thinking about this some more - first the limp was bad, but then so is betting into 4 more limpers. Then on the turn you miss you check and someone bets.... Don't bet draws out of position. That is one thing TJ Cloutier wrote that I really agree with.
You are getting 1/3 on your call, which is plenty with your hand and implied odds.
Now, if you had raised 200 PF, and get one caller lets say. With the blinds the pot is 475. Now betting half the pot, lets say 250. Well that looks weak, and anyone with TT+ and maybe even smaller pockets is going to raise you or at least call. So then what? now the pot is 1000 on the turn and your hand is not longer so strong. You going to toss in another 500? For a total of 950 out of your 2000 chips invested?
What if you get raised on the flop? Are you going to fold? I don't think you can lead out half assed on this flop, a full pot bet or all-in is all you can do or you will bleed off chips.
Worst case you are up against a set or AA, and you still have 1/3 chance of busting them. otherwise you have 12-15 outs twice. Why go broke slowly?
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February 8th, 2005 #9
Anytime that I am first person to enter a pot and I'm playing the hand, I like to raise to MTT's whether I'm UTG or in MP and everyone has folded to me.
The only way that you can play this loose table confidently is by being the aggressor or fold. You can't really call with a hand like AQ PF at a table like this whether it's calling a raise or the BB because the guessing game is too hard to beat so you need to have information going into the flop on what you're up against.
That being said, you elected to limp and you saw a flop of:
Flop
pot: T350
You don't know how good you are in this hand and to make a hand, you have 9 spades, 3 Queens, and 3 Aces for 15 outs. You have to figure that an Ace will make one the limpers that you allowed to see the flop to have A9 or A7 to stay out of trouble, so you're looking for 12 outs.
You're only an 11:9 dog against A9 here so I would like a bet of T200 only if the table has been prone to loose limping PF and tight folding on the flop. Otherwise, the check/call is your best choice and I doubt that the first case is the situation.
I do like your check on the turn. It wasn't weak. The board was weak. You might play TT or JJ the same way. If the button has a straight or a set, this is a pot odds situation where you're investing a little to win all of or at least 500 more.
This is Level IV of a $2 MTT and yes, your play on this hand was weak. Folding preflop is a better idea than calling because you avoid the guessing game, but I believe that a raise is in order UTG preflop. You allowed to many hands to enter the pot to not know how many outs you had to that board.
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