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Thread: BB play

  1. #1
    PokerForums God Marm's Avatar
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    Default BB play

    errum.... THis may have been posted a while back, I vaguely remeber something along these lines. If not, we'll crank out another chapter of steve-o's book for him (like we've been doin )

    Play out of the BB. Need help.

    PT after 962 hands has me at -.59 BB/hand out of the BB. I only have 2 other positions in the red, and they are less than -.1 bb/hand, so I'm chalking that up to the limited DB size. -.59 is a MAJOR leak that needs plugged. Perhaps it is due to the fact that out of 117 BB hands, only 4 have a W$SD >0%, and a WTSD of around 24 hands. This tells me 2 things. That 1) maybe the smaple size is stil no tbig enough and I have had bad luck, or more likely 2) I'm taking these crap hands too far into a hand because I got a cheap/free look at the flop.

    I am earning like .25 bb/hand per all other positions, on average. I am a little (like 20 bets) over break even. This is telling me my play in the BB is A MAJOR LEAK that needs plaugged.

    Limit HE, btw.
    Last edited by Marm; 02-02-2005 at 11:15 PM.
    Marm is back, maybe. Been off for 3 years. Rusty as Hell.

    Luck is a Residue of Design.

  2. #2
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    Default

    are you biggest losers from limping or defending?

  3. #3
    (Formerly Steve-O) Steve Ruddock's Avatar
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    Default

    is -.59 BB, big bets or big blinds?

    I think its big bets but before i reply I don't want to assume it is.
    Read my musings on poker and life at Online Poker Examiner, Poker Examiner, PokerNewsBoy.com, and My Poker Blog

  4. #4
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    Default

    I believe it is Big Bets that poker tracket uses.

  5. #5
    (Formerly Steve-O) Steve Ruddock's Avatar
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    Typically the mistake people make with their blinds is calling when they should fold and folding when they should call.

    Most people (not saying you do this Marm) will defend their blind with AXs/KT type hands, good heads up hands, but will fold 22/89/T7s type hands, bad heads up hands.

    when your opponent wants to steal your blind(or raise with a marginal hand) he pays a hard price, 2 bets to win 1.5, and he lays you 3.5 to 1.

    Against a lone raiser from middle or late position it is correct to defend your blind with a large variety of hands purely based on odds.

    Another common mistake is always calling and never 3 betting in these spots. you have a big advantage when you 3 bet and your oponent simply calls, you have in essence raised from EP and gotten a call from a late position player, you have taken control of the betting. you can now be the aggressor on ragged flops that miss you both with less fear of re-raise bluffs and such.

    if you could supply a few hands that you played from the BB that you are unsure of we could dissect them and see if their is a way to do things. or list your playlist of hands you defend with and such.differently.
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  6. #6
    PokerForums God Marm's Avatar
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    Default

    Well my VPIP form the BB is 15.x% ('m at the inlaws again, so I dont have PT in front of me), At first I thought that was pretty good, then I realized that i s very high. I think my saw flop % would be a better indicator when mixed with the other stats, but I' dont know them right now.

    BUt thinking about it, -.59bb/hand is a huge whole, thats -5.9bb/100, if i can cut that loss rate in half, my win rate will jump to about 5bb/100, still not great, but a good number.
    Marm is back, maybe. Been off for 3 years. Rusty as Hell.

    Luck is a Residue of Design.

  7. #7
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    You know what? I have the same rate as you. But my VP$IP is a lot higher, 28%

    I am looking at the hands I raised or defended with though, and I don't really see a problem, just crap like someone boating to J2 and one stooopid steal attempt with 34o.

    More later, just got paged.

  8. #8
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    Default

    Lets look a blind defense hand from my last session.

    Hand #4186685-5381 at Madras ($.25/$.50 Hold'em)
    Powered by UltimateBet
    Started at 02/Feb/05 22:59:42

    beavis68 is at seat 0 with $10.30.
    Adax is at seat 1 with $7.20.
    tall_john is at seat 2 with $9.80.
    bean66 is at seat 4 with $9.45.
    Your Ad Here is at seat 5 with $55.75.
    postal4 is at seat 6 with $21.70.
    tshl is at seat 8 with $29.25.
    thejameser is at seat 9 with $34.95.
    The button is at seat 8.

    thejameser posts the small blind of $.10.
    beavis68 posts the big blind of $.25.

    beavis68:
    Adax: -- --
    tall_john: -- --
    bean66: -- --
    Your Ad Here: -- --
    postal4: -- --
    tshl: -- --
    thejameser: -- --

    Pre-flop:

    Adax folds. tall_john folds. bean66 folds. Your
    Ad Here folds. postal4 raises to $.50. tshl calls.
    thejameser folds. beavis68 calls.

    Flop (board: 9c Qh 2d):

    beavis68 checks. postal4 bets $.25. tshl folds.
    beavis68 folds. postal4 is returned $.25 (uncalled).




    Hand #4186685-5381 Summary:

    Should I have raised PF and lead on the flop? I hate blind defending.


    Here is another one.

    beavis68: Ac 5s
    rickjr1120: -- --
    TypeONegtive: -- --
    Rockwood84: -- --
    LMP919: -- --
    Erncash: -- --

    Pre-flop:

    Hairhooker folds. LdyLck71 folds. no1kanbeatme
    folds. pilotfb70 folds. beavis68 checks.
    rickjr1120 raises to $.50. TypeONegtive folds.
    Rockwood84 calls. LMP919 calls. Erncash folds.
    beavis68 calls.

    Flop (board: 2s 2d Ts):

    LMP919 checks. beavis68 checks. rickjr1120 bets
    $.25. Rockwood84 calls. LMP919 calls. beavis68
    folds.

    Turn (board: 2s 2d Ts 6h):

    LMP919 checks. rickjr1120 bets $.50. Rockwood84
    calls. LMP919 calls.

    River (board: 2s 2d Ts 6h 6d):

    LMP919 checks. rickjr1120 bets $.50. Rockwood84
    folds. LMP919 raises to $1. rickjr1120 calls.



    Showdown:

    LMP919 shows 2c 8c.
    LMP919 has 2c 2s 2d 6h 6d: full house, deuces full of sixes.
    rickjr1120 mucks cards.
    (rickjr1120 has 3d 3s.)

  9. #9
    (Formerly Steve-O) Steve Ruddock's Avatar
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    Default

    now Beavis in another thread you said defending with 67s or 78s is suicide.

    So you defend with Ax over suited connectors?

    I'd like to hear your thoughts on this.
    Read my musings on poker and life at Online Poker Examiner, Poker Examiner, PokerNewsBoy.com, and My Poker Blog

  10. #10
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Steve-O
    now Beavis in another thread you said defending with 67s or 78s is suicide.

    So you defend with Ax over suited connectors?

    I'd like to hear your thoughts on this.
    First, I am asking for help, second, if someone has my Ax dominated, they really aren't stealing are they? The ace has some strength - this is my thinking, but please tell me when I am wrong.

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