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Thread: 2 pair on flop

  1. 01-07-2005 #1
    coash
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    Default 2 pair on flop

    just say you know the other guy will call, if you hit top 2 pair on the flop, do you go all in?
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  2. 01-07-2005 #2
    NoManner
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    Default

    um, this is poker? it depends?

    heres my advice, look at it from their point of view:
    let's say you're down to heads up with a person and you're in position
    there's sort of a raggedy flop (no straight, no flush) and the guy goes all in first to act
    what sort of cards are you going to be calling with?

    Any pair: no
    TPTK: no
    bottom two pair: no (here it starts to get fuzzy)
    top/bottom pair: depends on player
    top two pair: depends on player
    lowest set: yes (still fuzzy)

    so when you know they're going to call, chances are that unless he's a complete idiot, you're being dominated
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  3. 01-07-2005 #3
    Beavis68
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    If you know your opponent will call with a worse hand, yeah push it.
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  4. 01-07-2005 #4
    eclinchy
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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Beavis68
    If you know your opponent will call with a worse hand, yeah push it.
    derf...
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  5. 01-07-2005 #5
    xxdemexx
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    Default Victim..

    Quote Originally Posted by coash
    just say you know the other guy will call, if you hit top 2 pair on the flop, do you go all in?
    Well if he will call with 7 high then it's probably worth it...

    Two pair is the first VICTIM hand. You should NEVER go all in with 2 pair because:

    1] the odds that the guy hold TPTK are small if you have TP. Therefore you only win blinds - Very few ppl will call an All-in with TP unless its they have AK or over pair. All ins if you have two pair will generally be met with folds all around.

    2]You are very likely to be called by trips or a made str8 - the outs are there for this ndn if you're all in you routinely then you give the tablethe odds for the call. Your outs for a full house (which don't help him are too small to think about). Whenever you get an all in on the turn because of trips look at the victims .. they usually hold two pair...

    The exception is when you're up against a flush bluffer.. If there are two suited cards on the flop and he's gone all in then it's worth following.

    The second VICTIM hand is a made set with one of your hole cards against two on flop ..this is rarer .. but very expensive.. it's very hard to put down 7 2 off suite if there x77 on the table and someone is betting hard against you. This does happen particularly if you got the 72 on the BB. Again this is usually defeated by a trip.

    Third victim hand is flush against full house. Very rare..actually I did this tonight at VC -I had 22 which tripped and a guy who made an ace high flush on the flop slow played it..

    Forth victim hand is quads against full house..I did this once...


    The reason PP are so powerful is they expliot all the victim hands,they cant be seen (unlike flushes) and in NL .. they take someones stack...

    Bob
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  6. 01-07-2005 #6
    Beavis68
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    I have to disagree with bob, but that does not mean that PUSHING all in with two pair is always the best choice.

    A lot of poeple will go all-in with top pair, and if those people go all-in on you, even it is likely that is what they have - even though you both share that pair.
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  7. 01-08-2005 #7
    Irexes
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    Default

    I was reading this post while limping with K5o

    Just me (SB) and the BB

    Flop came K 5 7 (rainbow)

    Check, check

    Turn A

    Check from me, Small bet, I call

    River 3

    I bet half pot, he folds




    Could have got more I'm sure, but I agree 2 pair on the flop is a great way to lose big and win small
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  8. 01-08-2005 #8
    K C
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    Let's see here. You're looking to go heads up with a guy and you know he'll call your all-in. Right off the bat you know he's a very loose player. Two pair on the flop is a strong hand against even a full table, and is VERY strong against a single opponent. Especially one who makes loose calls. If the guy were a rock who would only call an all-in with a hand stronger than that, then of course you'd have to be much, much more careful. It's always a matter of what your chances are versus a random hand, in comparison with what kind of hands particular opponents will play on with in the particular instance.

    If this were calling an all-in, then it would probably be a whole different story. In this case though, count your good fortune and push it.

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  9. 01-08-2005 #9
    Beavis68
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    Quote Originally Posted by Irexes
    I was reading this post while limping with K5o

    Just me (SB) and the BB

    Flop came K 5 7 (rainbow)

    Check, check

    Turn A

    Check from me, Small bet, I call

    River 3

    I bet half pot, he folds




    Could have got more I'm sure, but I agree 2 pair on the flop is a great way to lose big and win small
    No, two pair is a good hand, and needs to be protected. Of you had AK would have you played it that weakly? Makes no sense.

    Why would you wait for the river to bet half the pot?
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  10. 01-08-2005 #10
    Irexes
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    Default

    I guess cause I limped, so he had a free ride from the BB. I never like this situation as the lack of info on the BB worries me.

    A decent bet on the flop was only going to get called by something nasty or reraised back putting me in trouble (in my mind at least)

    I was confident I was ahead and was trying to extract some chips from the situation, aiming to show weakness and call (or raise) a bet from him. This is also a cowardly way to avoid confrontation when I have no read on his hand.

    If I hit two pair with a hand I've played in other position (ie. 67s) I would indeed play it stronger on the flop.

    I just don't trust SB specials against the BB, I guess
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