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  1. #1
    River Rat
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Posts
    289

    Default This is why I never limp or min raise AK....

    Dude was a fucking moron, just waiting for my spot.... I'm making this play every day and twice on Sunday in this spot.... He raises this to T1K, I'm dropping this like a bad habit, for T400 I'm looking to stack someone...

    PokerStars No-Limit Hold'em Tourney, Big Blind is t200 (9 handed) CP hand converter

    UTG+1 (t9415)
    MP1 (t16696)
    MP2 (t29002)
    MP3 (t10060)
    CO (t2895)
    Button (t4840)
    SB (t8610)
    Hero (t9087)
    UTG (t17170)

    Preflop: Hero is BB with , .
    1 fold, UTG+1 raises to t600, 5 folds, SB calls t500, Hero calls t400.

    Flop: (t1800) , , (3 players)
    SB checks, Hero bets t1600, UTG+1 raises to t4400, SB folds, Hero raises to t8487, UTG+1 calls t4087.

    Turn: (t18774) (2 players)

    River: (t18774) (2 players)

    Final Pot: t18774

    Results in white below:
    Hero has 2d Ad (two pair, aces and twos).
    UTG+1 has Kc As (one pair, aces).
    Outcome: Hero wins t18774.

  2. #2
    Mike McDermott
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    West Virginia University
    Posts
    3,185

    Default

    He didn't min. raise. And I'm not a much a fan of the call.
    BOSS

  3. #3
    Stu Ungar obga's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2006
    Location
    USA - VA
    Posts
    2,843

    Default

    only 400 to call and suited


    id call this 3 times on sunday

  4. #4
    Mike McDermott
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    Mar 2006
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    West Virginia University
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    Default

    He didn't play it wrong though, IMO. He raised, got called, TPTK...he's really going to put someone on A2?
    BOSS

  5. #5
    River Rat
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Posts
    289

    Default

    I don't normally do this type of play against better opponents, but there was no way this guy was laying down AK. You have to know your opponent. Is he capable of laying down a monster, no. Ok then, you flopped 2 pair and you have him on AK or AQ, PUSH! It's that simple..

    If I'm in his shoes with 2 black cards and someone called me PF, and bets into me for the pot on that flop, I'm dropping that like a bad habit... It's just a play I've done before that works, but you have to know your spots, and you have to know what your opponent is likely to have..

    I know he's not going to raise UTG+1 with A9, so I know he's on a big A and I have him beat on the flop.... Like I said, I knew I was safe here, and in this spot it was a great play...

  6. #6
    Chaser
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Posts
    132

    Default

    90% of the time this play is not going to work. You hit a miracle flop against a donk that takes TPTK too far. Granted, you knew that if you hit the miracle you would stack him, but you aren't often going to hit the flop like that. Even if you have a good read on the guy, I still think this is a -EV play in the long run. There was also 2 hearts on the board, had he had Ah or Kh, you would have been stacked.

    I don t even like calling the BB with A rag suited though, so we are very diff players.

  7. #7
    Mike McDermott
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    Mar 2006
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    West Virginia University
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    Default

    But dude, this is the safest flop to keep going with AK on. Almost all people are not laying it down here and the only had I'd expect to see flipped over for someone fighting so much with would be 99. Otherwise, I'm thinking that YOU'RE a donk for staying in the hand with Ax.
    BOSS

  8. #8
    River Rat
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Posts
    289

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by eldave04
    90% of the time this play is not going to work. You hit a miracle flop against a donk that takes TPTK too far. Granted, you knew that if you hit the miracle you would stack him, but you aren't often going to hit the flop like that. Even if you have a good read on the guy, I still think this is a -EV play in the long run. There was also 2 hearts on the board, had he had Ah or Kh, you would have been stacked.

    I don t even like calling the BB with A rag suited though, so we are very diff players.

    I agree, but for T400 I want to see a flop, and I have the chips to do so.. If I dont hit 2 pair with no paint on the board or 2 or 3 diamonds I ck/fold the flop. Plain and simple. This is one play, in certain situations, agains certain players, in certain tournamenst, period!

    If I'm playing a $20 SnG, $11 SnG, even a $5 SnG I'm folding this to any raise, and I fold anything less than AT in any position other than the BB because I can't fold in the BB.

    In a $3 rebuy, before the break, I'm making this play. Remember also, he *could* have been raising with JJ+ even KQs so there was a small chance that ANY ace would have been good here.

  9. #9
    PokerForums God the alex's Avatar
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    Sep 2004
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    Nort Side o' Shi-kawgo
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    7,959

    Default

    I limp a lot and cold call a lot with Ace-King and it doesn't hurt my profit at all
    Quote Originally Posted by FaDi View Post
    GodFadiR (12:32:45 AM): but lets be honest
    GodFadiR (12:32:48 AM): who doesnt wanna fuck me
    WotaWotaWota (12:33:22 AM): I do
    WotaWotaWota (12:33:27 AM): in tehanus

  10. #10
    Poker Hustler Jason75's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
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    San Francisco, CA
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    1,230

    Default

    If you're just looking to hit 2 pair, TP + FD, or trip 2's . . . you're only in the neighborhood of 5% to flop it.

    So you need 20:1 on your call here to make this a break-even EV play.

    Note that you'd have to win 8K in chips to break even. Of course this doesn't take into account for the fact that your opponent still has a lot of outs to beat you once you flop 2 pair with the 2nd pair being 2's (I figure you're about 2:1 to win here, maybe as little as 2.3:1). So you just made a play that loses money (and quite a bit) over the long haul.
    Last edited by Jason75; 06-19-2006 at 11:11 AM.
    Jason75: Ok, you check and the button bets 400. Now what?
    Beavis68: You play poker.
    Jason75: Darn, I was really hoping for canasta. Maybe Gin.

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