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Go Back PokerForums.org > General > General Poker Discussion > late tounrnament strategy

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  #11 (permalink)  
Old 01-25-2006, 06:26 PM
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yeah, you pretty much asked him to put a beat on you here.

Preflop- Raise to 1200-1500. A minimum raise is doing nothing but asking people to come into the pot with you. Raise it strong when you open a pot

Flop- Had you raised bigger preflop, I doubt you would even be here. Assuming that you raised big and got called, you play here can go different ways. You can bet about 1500-2000 to try to take the pot down. If he then goes allin, things aren't looking good, and based on reads, you can call it or live to fight another day.
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  #12 (permalink)  
Old 01-26-2006, 09:41 AM
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Alright here goes:

I don't mind the supposed weakness of the PF play - you are not in a great position. Now - you say you have a read on the guy? What was your read? Loose or tight? Pehaps his read on you was better? He knows you have AK or AQ probably and he spots your continuan bet and decides you've missed the flop and to take the pot down, he has 3-1ish shot at a flush if his read is wrong. So what was your read on him? Lets assume its loose. So he plays any two cards? Suited connectors, unsuited connectors, any Ax Kx Qx Jx etc..?? what if he hits two pair? on the flop?

You played the hand perfectly until that last call IMO, You had a bet at it preflop as you should have, and it had the desired result you narrowed the field substantially, you tried then top take it down on the flop and he called your continuan bet, Alarm bells should be ringing at this point, he's got something or hes drawing to something, yes you're ahead but he has a ton of outs. Fold the damn hand and contest something you have more chance of winning!!!

You did what too many people do here, all your thinking is I have AK thats one of the best hands.
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  #13 (permalink)  
Old 01-26-2006, 10:50 AM
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I'd have been all in preflop.

Your min raise was the worst possible thing to do and your flop play screamed weakness and was asking to be reraised.

When he raised with the flush draw (a solid move by him, though I'd have put you allin then and there) he was bound to call no matter what you did.

As I say I'd have been allin preflop more often than not but certainly would have made a bigger raise. If I was going to bluff the flop (which is what you did) I'd have been allin and made him think long and hard.

You'd have struggled to play that worse.

Apologies if the above is harsh, but you want genuine feedback I guess.

Last edited by Irexes; 01-26-2006 at 10:52 AM.
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  #14 (permalink)  
Old 01-26-2006, 11:01 AM
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And regarding the end of tournaments (although 30 left of 130 is not exactly the end) the "normal" rules for calling and raising often go out the window and it's a case of the most aggressive player with the best grasp of who's weak wins.

Looking at the hand from the other guy's point of view..


The kind of value call he made preflop doesn't necessarily mean he's a fish, if I'd seen you make similar plays in the past I'd have certainly thought about calling (how many chips did he have as this critical).

Once he calls and you make a weak stab at it on the flop it's a fair bet you don't have an overpair (you would have checked and hoped for action) and you probably would have raised AJ a bit more preflop (people tend to raise the "weaker" premium hands more when the blinds get big as they don't really want a caller). Of course it's entirely possible you had connected with the flop but I'd have been fairly confident you either had two overcards or a low pocket pair. A reraise at this point is a good %age play, though as I say if I was going to do it I'd push and make you lay it down unless you had a J or an overpair. I'd expect to win one in three by making you fold, lose one in three to better cards and win one in three on the strength of my hand.

Of course he could also be a fish, the dividing line between great and stupid play is very fine sometimes (see my callin with ATs at a final table the other day for a case study)
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  #15 (permalink)  
Old 01-26-2006, 04:35 PM
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i'm not agrueing his call pf, i woulda done the same thing, he had 10 000 in chips, to that point in the tourny i was playing really tight and only entering with big hands.. he had just moved to the table and hadn't seen me play a hand yet eather.. i'm thinking my pf and post flop raise was too weak, if he was to reraise there on the flop i should of least made the point that if he was going to put me all in i was pot committed which meant he was going to have to hit his draw to any over pair. i guess i was playing to conservative as it got down to the money.. and i'm not married to ak eather, i make folds when i think i need to with it and i play aggressively with it when i think i can take down the pot. in this instance i smelled weakness from him.
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Old 01-26-2006, 04:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dopemope223
how would you have played the hand in my situation then beavis?
I am with Irexes on the all-in pre-flop.

i don't like to play games as a short stack. If you raise to 1200 and get called. there is 2550-2850 in the pot and you would only have 3800 left. Any decent bet is pretty much going to commit you anyway.

I would be moving in with a lot of hands pre-flop with that stack, so I wouldn't feel like I wasted AKs.
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  #17 (permalink)  
Old 01-26-2006, 04:46 PM
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i think u should have just raised all in pf here.. ur at about 16BB and ur out of position.. so if u raise and someone (or a few people) call you, ur gonna have a hardtime playing this hand.. better to just put it all in pf
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